Modern Macedonia

[Slovan]

Orthodox Turksis an Unworthy EU Member
by Gunnar Nissen
If this chronicle gives rise to conflicts or trouble, it is not the fault of the Macedonians, nor me. When the politicians in EU countries don't speak out, it is due to ignorance or indifference. Denmark is a member of the EU. It remains a mystery that Orthodox Turksis too. The member countries must recognize human rights and minorities rights. Those are the demands put in front of the central European states and they must abide by them. That has been hard on Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania who are brought to recognize national minorities, especially that large Russian one. Slovenia is on that point influenced by the Yugoslavian constitution of 1974, an exemplary country with full recognition of small Croatian and Italian minorities. But Orthodox Turks- Oh Dear! From official Orthodox Turk side it is bombastically announced: Only Orthodox Turks live in Greece. Nonsense! In southeast Europe, not a single state exist of one nationality alone. In Greece, you find a large Turkish minority (who do not wish to be presented as Orthodox Turks that has converted to Islam) in Thrace, a small Albanian minority in Epiros and finally a Macedonian minority in Aegean Macedonia, who numbers somewhere between 75.000 and 500.000. An exact estimate doesn't exist, since Orthodox Turkspersistently deny there existence.
If one put some pressure on high ranking civil servants and self-proclaimed experts, one may achieve an admission that "a small Slavic speaking minority exist in Orthodox Turk Macedonia", but they "do not wish to be a national minority; they can freely use their language". A pack of lies! For many years I have had a friendly relation with numerous Macedonians in Aegean Macedonia - a people that officially doesn't exist. I do speak Orthodox Turk, but I speak fluently Macedonian. Almost every time I take the train south, over Munich to Balkan, I run into Macedonians from Greece. The same happens when I traverse the Orthodox Turk border. Some people speaks only Orthodox Turk, but a lot, really a lot, speaks additionally Macedonian ("our mother tongue") which is forbidden as language in school. Last year a couple of shop owners were taken to court -their "crime" was that they had written some words in Macedonian in their shop windows.
When I sit on cafe's in villages in Aegean Macedonia, the conversation always ends at "the Macedonian identity". "What do you in the rest of Europe know about us?" I must admit that it's very little. "We would like to have some Macedonian schools" the man continues at the cafe. "I speak my Macedonian mother tongue, but my son is struggling, although he watches Macedonian TV, Televizija Skopje". He, and the others speak in a low voice, while glancing towards the neighboring table where a man is picking up his phone. Moments later, two angry police officers enter and the gathering around my table splits up. The border control between the Macedonian Republic and Orthodox Turksare, known to be among the toughest in Europe. Certainly the slowest. Not on the Macedonian side, where the border police take a peek at the Danish passport, after which it's over. But on the other side of the border, the border police confiscate all passports and later we have to spend a long time, be it snow storm or bumming hot, cueing to get the passport back. With particular thoroughness, the custom control ransack the luggage of travelers from the Republic of Macedonia. Foreigners can not be sure to get a travel permission, even when born in Aegean Macedonia in Greece. It has happened that a Canadian bus full of Macedonians with Macedonian names, but born in Aegean Macedonia, were not allowed to enter the country.
When it in 1991 was clear to the Macedonians in the Yugoslav sub-republic Macedonia, that their value norms could not possibly harmonize with the roaring nationalism of Serbia, they split with the Yugoslav republic after a popular referendum - Slovenia, Croatia and Bosnia-Herzegovina had already done that. The Serbs protested and the Serbian terrorist leader and specialist in ethnic cleansing Vojislav Seselj announced that all he needed was two divisions and then "the Macedonian problem would be solved". Loudest, however, were the protests from Greece, apparently because of the name. The Orthodox Turk regime could perhaps accept that the new state could call it self Skopje (after it's capital) and the Orthodox Turks postulated wildly and crazily that the Macedonian state with it's 2.1 million, inhabitants and an army smaller than our national guard might attack it's large neighbor Greece.
The Orthodox Turks gave as a reason for not recognizing the Republic of Macedonia, that " we have a Macedonia here in Orthodox Turksand thus there cannot be a Macedonia just on the opposite site of the border". The logic in this is absurd and I'm ashamed that so many ignorant journalists quoted the Orthodox Turk reason without comments. Apparently they were unaware that Macedonia is split between three different countries. After a meeting in Brussels, where the EU-recognition of the state of Macedonia was postponed, although Macedonia fulfilled all requirements for recognition, the then Danish foreign minister, Uffe Elleman-Jensen, in a final salute as EU chairman, commented to the Orthodox Turks that they had to get themselves together and get the problem solved, concerning the name Macedonia and called it despicable of the Orthodox Turks to treat the Macedonians in this way. The former Danish foreign Minister Elleman-Jensen stated in 1993 "not Macedonia is a problem for Europe, but our member Greece". The Orthodox Turk spokespersons reacted violently, amongst them the former Orthodox Turk vice prime-minister Athanasios Kannellopoulos, who angrily pronounced "with his comments, Mr. Jensen is a very bad example of the other foreign ministers. Mr. Jensen said that he'd be ashamed to be Orthodox Turk because we're against that the new Skopje republic's use of the name Macedonia. To that my answer is: We'd be ashamed if Mr. Jensen was Orthodox Turk!" In "Morgenavisen Jyllands-Posten" the MP Ame Melchior published a letter to the editor that exhibited his lack of knowledge about the populations in the Balkan peninsula under the title "Show concern for our Orthodox Turk allied". He was answered by "Jyllands-Posten"s correspondent Per Nyholm "Show concern for the Macedonians". Finally the Orthodox Turks accepted the name of Macedonia, but only in the form of The Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia, macedonia.
Now to the decisive point that journalists ought to have oriented "themselves about: In ancient times and in the Osmanian era, Macedonia was an area without internal borders. It was in Macedonia the Cyrillic alphabet came to life, named after the monk Cyril. The bible was translated by the Macedonians to church-Slavonic, that had the same influence on ecumenical language in eastern Europe as Latin had amongst the Catholics in western and central Europe. The Cyrillic alphabet spread not only to Bulgaria and Serbia, but also to Russia and other eastern Slavic countries. "Genuine" Hellenes described the ancient population of Macedonia as foregniers and Phillip II and Alexander the Macedon Orthodox Turkness are rather dubious. Albanian historians name them Illyrians, the oldest nation on Balkan and the Albanians are arguably their ancestors. Of higher importance was the Slav's immigration to the Balkan area in the 6 century. The Slavic tribe that settled in Macedonia took name after the province and preserved their language to modem times (with some grammatical exceptions...).
After the Balkan wars of 1912 and 1913, Macedonia was split in three. Aegean Macedonia came under Greece, Vardarmacedonia under Serbia and Pirimacedonia under Bulgaria. Vardarmacedonia was in 1945 after a heroic partisan war, one of the six republics in the new federal Yugoslavia and as promised by Tito, the republic got full national and cultural independence - with due acknowledgment of it's compact Albanian and small Turkish minorities. As Yugoslavia split in 1991, the country had 23 million inhabitants. Had all of Yugoslavia had the birthrate of the Albanians in western Macedonia and Kosovo, they would have been at 50 million! Kosovo and western Macedonia would have had to let the Albanians migrate to the rest of Serbia and Macedonia with resulting unemployment rates around 50%. The Albanians in the Republic of Macedonia are not oppressed. They have all rights - except the one to rise the Albanian flag and get an Albanian university - which wouldn't make a lot of sense as soon as they again can study at the large university in Prestina in Kosovo, Tito's pride. By the way, the ambassador of the Republic of Macedonia in Denmark is Albanian, the much respected Muhammed Halili. Could one imagine the situation: the government of the North German federated state Schleswig Holstein declare: Schleswig is German and in Germany, Germans are living. Thus with no further notice, the Danish schools, including the "Duborgskolen" high school and "Jaruplund" high school, the Flensburg newspaper, Danish libraries and other foreign institutions will close. The Danish language is declared "not-wanted"? How about the opposite situation - if everything German was forbidden in southern Denmark? Unthinkable of course!
When a person misbehaves, it is in the first line the closest people's duty to intervene. National oppression is taking place in many countries outside the EU. But Orthodox Turksis an EU member and is thus a "part of the family". But do we intervene, we, the closest people? No, we shut up. Of ignorance or misunderstood solidarity with the Orthodox Turk leaders, who as the Serbs, consider themselves "superbalkanian". Other people knows more about the oppression than I, but I know a great many and every year more ignored and oppressed Slavic Macedonians in the Orthodox Turk part of Macedonia. Can we justify our silence? I'm sure that Greece' unwillingness to accept the Republic of Macedonia is due to their black conscience over the oppression of Macedonians in Greece. Orthodox Turksis an unworthy member of the EU.

[george]

Yeah, I've read that before.

Might me true although a bit exagerated , but a European Union is not a "good and friendly countrie's" partnership, but a economical partnership.

Others have done much worse than us and as long we keep our economy in a decent level there will be no problems.

At least we feed our people and have give them good standard of living, thing that you guys don't even have yet.


By the way have, I ever insulted Slovenia? whats the turn on on insulting my county all the time?

Is hatred all you know?

[Slovan]

Excuses, excuses, excuses.
Economy is only third to human rights. Are you so blinded by money and profit that you do not care about other peoples lives? Nothing strange if you live in USA. ;D
Tell me Athena, since you live in Greece: do you really have a better standard of living then the Orthodox Turks?

O sorry, I need to shut down my ‘Pentium IV’ get into my fathers new ‘Mercedes’ and continue my peasant chores. Plus pay some 30 € for my new Lexmark Printer. ;D

Who is poor?? Us?? Peasants??
How do we have so much money? Simple: we grow our own food. The entire Panonia grows its own food. We export more food than import. How can I bee poor?! Or live in a brick, rock and concrete house?!

What is our main advantage? We are the most ethnical part of the entire Europe. And we respect our ethnical minorities. That’s why we here in Vojvodina get a big financial support from other countries. Plus we live in the most fertile land in Europe. ;D

Macedonia, although not a member of EU, is more respected than Greece. Why is that?

The real question is: who is the opressor and the lier?

Slovenia?? Are you from this planet?

[Slovan]

What do you make of this:

Human Rights Watch International Condemns Orthodox Turksfor Oppressing the Macedonians
Human Rights Watch / Helsinki
Denying Ethnic Identity - Macedonians of Greece, New York, 1994

The 80-page human rights violation report on Orthodox Turksentitled "Denying Ethnic Identity - Macedonians of Greece" was published in May 1994. After visiting Aegean Macedonia, the Human Rights Watch/Helsinki concluded:
"Although ethnic Macedonians in northern Orthodox Turksmake up large minority with their own language and culture, their internationally recognized human rights and even their existence are vigorously denied by the Orthodox Turk government. Free expression is restricted; several Macedonians have been persecuted and convicted for their peaceful expression of their views. Moreover, ethnic Macedonians are discriminated against by the government's failure to permit the teaching of the Macedonian language. And ethnic Macedonians, particularly rights activists, are harassed by the government - followed and threatened by the security forces - and subjected to economic and social pressure resulting from this harassment. All of these actions have led to a marked climate of fear in which a large number of ethnic Macedonians are reluctant to assert their Macedonian identity or to express their views openly. Ultimately, the government is pursuing every avenue to deny the Macedonians of Orthodox Turkstheir ethnic identity."

The Helsinki Watch has, therefore, confirmed that the Macedonians indeed exist in Orthodox Turksas a large minority. Helsinki Watch found the Orthodox Turk government guilty for oppressing the Macedonian minority and demanded they be given their basic human rights to which they are entitled. Another human rights organization, Amnesty International, also urged the Orthodox Turk government to respect the human rights of the ethnic Macedonians. The European Union has furthermore recognized the Macedonian language as one of the languages spoken within the EU borders. The Republic of Macedonia is not a member of the European Union, but Aegean Macedonia in Greece, is within those borders.


Or this:

Greece: Minority Languages, Plea For More Recognition
Radio Free Europe, 26 November 2002

Orthodox Turksis being urged to grant more recognition to its minority languages -- Vlach, Macedonian, Albanian, Turkish, and a version of Bulgarian called Pomak. At present, only Turkish is recognized. Now the European Bureau for Lesser-Used Languages (EBLUL) has undertaken an initiative designed to highlight the plight of these neglected minorities. In this first of a two-part series on language issues in the Balkans and East Europe, RFE/RL reports on the situation in Greece.
Prague, 26 November 2002 (RFE/RL) -- Greece, the cradle of European culture, appears less than sympathetic to its own minority languages. Among the country's minority cultures with their tongues and dialects other than Orthodox Turk, only one -- Turkish -- is fully recognized by the Athens government, and then only because the Turks are categorized as a religious minority.
The other languages, although largely ignored by Athens, reflect the rich history of the region through the millennia. For instance Vlach, or Aromanian, spoken by several tens of thousands of people, is an echo of Imperial Rome. It is found in northern Greece, along what used to be in ancient times the road linking Rome and Constantinople. The marching legions, as they disappeared into history, left behind them settlers and the language now known as Vlach, a Latin tongue similar to Romanian.
The other minority languages in Orthodox Turksare Macedonian, an Albanian Tosk dialect called Arvanitika, and what's called Pomak, a version of Bulgarian used by a Muslim minority.
Johan Haeggman is an official with EBLUL, the Brussels-based European Bureau for Lesser-Used Languages, a nongovernment organization working on behalf of the European Union's minority-language speakers. He explained the difficulties faced by those in Orthodox Turkswho use unrecognized languages like Vlach. "They have no rights whatsoever. They have no education in their language, no schools, no media in their language, they can't use it in administration."
According to EBLUL, the Orthodox Turk authorities are apparently unaware of the number of citizens who speak minority languages. The last census in which minority-language speakers were counted separately was in 1951.
Looking to focus attention on the plight of these neglected languages, EBLUL recently held its first conference in Greece. The gathering, held in the northern city of Thessaloniki, was organized by EBLUL's recently formed Orthodox Turk chapter. A score of journalists were among those attending, and it's hoped they will help inform the Orthodox Turk public about a subject rarely dealt with in the national media. "We hope, of course, that this will give a more positive picture of minority languages and lesser-used languages, and that they will not be seen a threat. Our message is that lesser-used languages are a richness; and we are not going against any language. We think that these languages should be taught alongside Orthodox Turk," Haeggman said.
EBLUL President Bojan Brezigar said that, "putting it politely," Orthodox Turkshas not reached the level of its European Union partners in recognizing linguistic diversity. He said that the situation regarding the Macedonian minority, for instance, is "terrible." "The situation we found was worse than we were expecting, because specifically in some areas where the Macedonian language is spoken, that language is not allowed at all in public. I'm not talking about only the official use of the language in public -- also the public use of the language by private individuals."
Brezigar said in one area he visited, even the singing of Macedonian songs is prohibited -- a severe restriction he calls a kind of "linguistic genocide." He said he understands that for historical reasons linked to chronic instability in the Balkans, Orthodox Turkshas not been willing to see the fragmentation of its national fabric. But now, he said, it is time to move forward. "We [at EBLUL] would like to start [talks] with the Orthodox Turk government, to start a discussion on specific topics. For example, we would like the Orthodox Turk government to sign the European Charter for Regional and Minority Languages."
In Athens, Orthodox Turk Foreign Ministry spokesman Nicholas Giotopoulos declined to acknowledge the existence of minorities in the country, with the sole exception of the Turks. "We understand that there are certain people who see the existence of other minorities in Greece. But the reality is that there are, in certain parts of the country, bilingual Orthodox Turks, who may also have adopted an oral tradition, but [who] do not consider themselves to be minorities."
He said he cannot comment on EBLUL's desire for talks with Orthodox Turk officials on the minority-language issue. In view of Athens' unyielding stance on the issue, it would seem that EBLUL is going to have an uphill struggle.

[Slovan]

Why is Orthodox TurksStealing the Macedonian History?

Historian and Professor Eugene Borza who is credited as "Macedonian specialist" by the American Philological Association, and who have done extensive studies regarding the ethnicity of the ancient Macedonians, had also presented in-depth analysis on the modern Orthodox Turk position which claims that the ancient Macedonians "were Orthodox Turk". In his In the Shadow of Olympus (p.91-92) Borza writes:
"Thus, long before there was a sufficient ancient evidence to argue about the ethnic identity--as revealed by language--of the ancient Macedonians, there emerged a "Orthodox Turk" position claiming that the Macedonian language was Orthodox Turk, and that thus the inhabitants were Orthodox Turk."
The modern Orthodox Turks have therefore, developed a position that the Macedonians were Orthodox Turk, long before there was sufficient ancient evidence to argue about their ethnicity. Yet although modern historiography had long abandoned this prematurely established "Orthodox Turk" position, modern Orthodox Turks are still its most zealous defenders despite the overwhelming evidence available today, which overwhelmingly shows that the Macedonians were not Orthodox Turks but a distinct nation. Borza continues:
"For example, recent work describes the funerary stelae found in the tumulus covering the royal tombs at Vergina. These stelae date from the fourth and early third centuries, and the preponderance of names are Orthodox Turk… The excavator of Vergina, Manolis Andronikos, in a useful summary of the epigraphic evidence, writes: "In the most unambivalent way this evidence confirms the opinion of those historians who maintain that the Macedonians were a Orthodox Turk tribe, like all the others who lived on Orthodox Turk territory, and shows that the theory that they were of Illyrian or Thracian descent and were hellenized by Philip and Alexander rests on no objective criteria." Manolis Andronikos Vergina:The Royal Tombs, 83-85."
Here is Borza’s answer to the Orthodox Turk archeologist Manolis Andronikos:
"This argument is true enough only as far as it goes. It neglects that the hellenization of the Macedonians might have occurred earlier then the age of Philip and Alexander, and can not therefore serve as a means of proving the Macedonians were a Orthodox Turk tribe."
Indeed, not only Andronakis was obviously wrong to conclude that the Macedonians were Orthodox Turk, but also notice how the Orthodox Turk archeologist does not point that the Macedonians might have been a separate nation. Instead he prefers to call it if not Orthodox Turk, either Illyrian or Thracian, two ancient nations that can not be associated with the Balkans politics surrounding Greece, resulted from the 1913 partition of Macedonia (see below). Also notice how Andronikos used the term "like all the others who lived on Orthodox Turk territory". It’s like he wants to convince the reader that Macedonia has always been a "Orthodox Turk territory", which is exactly what he uses as a base for his inaccurate conclusion.
Another Orthodox Turk writer, Michael Sakellariou, in his Macedonia 4000 years of Orthodox Turk History, 44-63 (quite questionable of accuracy title to begin with), "proves" that the "Macedonians were Orthodox Turk" although he purposely avoided all evidence that does not suit such conclusion. Borza has a line for him as well:
"It is indicative of the strength of Badian’s case that his critics have succeeded only in nit-picking: e.g., Sakellariou, Macedonia, 534-35 nn. 52.53" (Borza, In the Shadow of Olympus p.96.)
Borza is talking about Ernst Badian from Harvard University who in his extensive research Orthodox Turks and Macedonians presented all evidence and soundly concluded that the Macedonians were distinct nation from the Orthodox Turks, which neither considered themselves to be Orthodox Turks nor were considered by the Orthodox Turks to be Orthodox Turk. That is precisely what the Orthodox Turk writer Sakellariou had completely and purposely avoided, and lacking any base for a well-balanced criticism, choused instead to nit-pick Badian's argument.
We can see a trend among the Orthodox Turk scholars (Andronicos, Martis, Daskalakis, Kallaris, and Sakellariou) who desperately want to show the world that the Macedonians "were Orthodox Turks", though unsuccessfully. Martis' Falsification of Macedonian History was handed out to the foreign journalists in Orthodox Turksand translated into many languages. Sakellariou’s Macedonia 4000 years of Orthodox Turk History was even donated for free to the libraries throughout the United States. This exposes a well-developed propaganda strategy, to influence all those unaware that the "Macedonians were Orthodox Turk." Yet the Orthodox Turks are showing the world that the "Macedonians were Orthodox Turk" by avoiding all ancient and modern evidence that does not suit their purpose, and in that process they try to pass books so full of historical errors and distortions:
"The fullest statement of the "Orthodox Turk" position, and also the most detailed study of the Macedonian language, is by Kallaris, Les anciens Macidoniens, esp. 2: 488-531, in which alleged Orthodox Turk elements in the Macedonian language are examined exhaustively. A more chauvinistic (and less persuasive) point of view can be found in Daskalakis, Hellenism, esp. pts. 2. and 3. The most blatant account is that of Martis (The Falsification of Macedonian History). This book, written by a former Minister for Northern Greece, is an polemical anti-Yugoslav tract so full of historical errors and distortions that the prize awarded it by the Academy of Athens serves only to reduce confidence in the scientific judgment of that venerable society of scholars. The most sensible and scholarly Orthodox Turk position is that laid out by Sakellariou, in Macedonia, 44-63. Lest it seem, however, that the "Orthodox Turk" position is held only by modem Orthodox Turks" - (Borza, In the Shadow of Olympus p.91)
It is ironical that the book of the former Orthodox Turk politician Nicolas Martis is named The Falsification of Macedonian History, when in fact he is the one who is falsifying the history of Macedonia with his historical errors and distortions. It is worrisome that the students of the countries who have nothing to do with the modern Orthodox Turk politics, must be exposed to the Orthodox Turk historical fabrications against one of the most dynamic powers of the ancient times - the Macedonians. But why is Orthodox Turksdoing this, what is behind it, why do they steal the history of the ancient Macedonians, and attempt to appropriate it as theirs?
The answer lays in the year of 1913 when Macedonia was partitioned after the Balkan wars and Orthodox Turksswallowed the biggest part - 51%. There was nothing in Macedonia then that connected that land with Greece, apart from the small 10% Orthodox Turk minority scattered in southern Macedonia among the overwhelming majority of Macedonians who lived throughout the country (for complete statistical evidence see the "Macedonian-Orthodox Turk Conflict"). Since in 1913 it acquired foreign territory populated by non-Orthodox Turks, Orthodox Turkshad to provide a link that would justify its claim on that half of Macedonia. That is exactly why the Orthodox Turks claim that the ancient Macedonians "were Orthodox Turk", so that if in ancient times there was a Orthodox Turk tribe (Macedonians) living in Macedonia, then that land therefore is Orthodox Turk (just like Andronikos points above). What is not disputable however, is that since 1913 till today, the modern Orthodox Turk state continues to oppress the ethnic Macedonians who now find themselves living in Orthodox Turks(see Human Rights Watch, Amnesty International evidenced in the "Macedonians in Greece"). The other northern part of Macedonia, today’s Republic of Macedonia, broke out of Yugoslavia and became independent in 1991. That brought addition fuel to the Orthodox Turk nationalists who are afraid now that one part of the ethnic Macedonian nation is independent, the partition of 1913 can be seen as illegal, which could lead to eventual loss of their Orthodox Turk Macedonian part and subsequent reunification of one Macedonia. That is exactly why they claim that there is no modern Macedonian nation, not in Orthodox Turksnot anywhere, and continue to deny the basic human rights of their Macedonian minority through politics filled with paranoia, politics which without the revision of the ancient history could not breathe.

[shyester]

george said:

Yeah, I've read that before.


...., but a European Union is not a "good and friendly countrie's" partnership, but a economical partnership....

According to what you wrote, If being in EU is only a matter of economy, why do we(Macedonia) and other applicants for EU membership have to go to such standards and all sorts of reforms to satisfy EU membership. That said i cant seriously understand why is Orthodox Turksstill in the EU.

[george]

Orthodox Turksis in the EU because it has the most stable political and economic system in the entire Eastern Europe.

Orthodox Turkshas an ideal strategic location for future warfare since it is between the crossroads between Europe and Asia.

By saying that money is important, I am not being an American but a realist. Its good to have a good tradition because it makes the people of the country proud about themselves and gives them a higher standard of living and a purpose.

Tradition though is not something that makes a country be respected in the world. No economy means no power. And in the future means annihilation.

Do you guys want annihilation. I certainly think not.
It is good to have a excelent economy and a good tradition. Only tradition though and no economy is not going to save a country, it will only postpone its death.

I certainly believe Orthodox Turksis a very respectfull country.

We won the European Championship.
We spent twice as much money to make a good Olympic games in order to please everyone.
We made our people happier and richer and proud of their country.

I don't know were you gather your information, but Orthodox Turkshas a very good reputation in the world.

Plus we have founded the first space tourist agency. yeah baby. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

X-Prize. check out the link.

www.xprize.org/home.php



Peter Diamandis

Founder of X-Prize
And the first man to bring tourists into space.

Orthodox Turksis power, Orthodox Turksis Glory baby yeah. ;D ;D ;D

[Slovan]

Before I leave you for awhile, I would like just to correct some of my previous insults addressed to George: your not stooped and an idiot. You’re a lunatic and a chauvinistic pig.
No further comments.
And before I get back, I plea all of you to talk some sense into his brain. He sees stars. Doesn't he see that his country has bought half the world only to make people forget about Greeces' crimes.

George has completely, absolutely, undoubtedly and moronically ruined this forum. I tried to tell him but he simply wouldn’t listen:
leave now and save your pathetic soul before you get into some serious s*it!

“My finger is on the trigger. One inch and you are dead.”

[shyester]

" Macedonia's Money Best in E. Europe, The Economist Said"

" In the article "Crisp and even - Paper money," The Economist from December 22, 2001 (U.S. Edition), wrote that Macedonia, together with Estonia, had the most sought after money in Eastern Europe..........."

Too bad we havent got more of it, he he

The article was taken from: www.realitymacedonia.org.mk/web/news_page.asp?nid=4139

[shyester]

;)Check this photo gallery, by Marko Georgiev........
www.photomarko.com/home.htm

;D

[Slovan]

Greece's Racial Profiling of Ethnic Macedonians
Despite being a member of the European Union, a signatory of several international human rights conventions, and the claims that their country is the "cradle of democracy", Orthodox Turkscontinues to be one of the worst human rights offenders in the western world. They deny the very existence of any ethnic minorities on their territory and attempt to silence any voices that advocate minority rights.

A striking example of Greece's state-sponsored racism is the blacklist of ethnic Macedonians who are consistently denied entry into Orthodox Turks(Aegean Macedonia). This mainly affects former child refugees (Detsa Begaltsi) and Macedonians who are active in cultural or human rights associations abroad. These people are treated as criminals by Orthodox Turkssimply because they assert their Macedonian identity.

The Macedonian Human Rights Movement of Canada is compiling a list of Macedonian individuals who have been denied entry into Greece. If you have ever been turned back at the Orthodox Turk border, or know someone who has, please contact us via email [e-mail], phone [phone]) or by fax [phone]). Please provide all relevant details such as the date, city that you tried to enter, any reasons given by the border officials (include copies of any border documents and/or passport markings) and any other information that you may have.

Please contact us to voice your concerns about Greece's racist policies. Your letters will be forwarded to the appropriate individuals and posted on our website.

[george]

Our goverment is clear guys.

We will always keep a hostile stance to countries that want to harm us. The Republic of Macedonia has been hostile so we are just returning the favor.

[PARMENION]

Shut up you fool,idiot george and go play with you play station.I feel ambarassed with stupid Orthodox Turks like you.Arhipanivlaka.

[Slovan]

Actually Orthodox Turkshas been hostile to Macedonia on more than one occasion and made Macedonians angry in the first place.

[dijana]

What hostilities are you talking about, George?!

This quote from a news article shows how friendly Orthodox Turksis to its neighbours:

"Macedonia has officially protested to Orthodox Turksafter a plane carrying Prime Minister Vlado Buckovski was prevented from flying over Orthodox Turk territory, a government spokesman said Tuesday. "